Meet Aurora De Lucia

We had the good fortune of connecting with Aurora De Lucia and we’ve shared our conversation below.

Hi Aurora, what role has risk played in your life or career?
I’ve been bungee jumping, and diving with bull sharks. I looove taking risks. Some people talk of being “risk averse,” but I think of myself as risk inclined. For instance, the best career move I ever made involved me taking what many would consider a risk, and moving to New York City with no notice. I’d flown in to NY for what was intended to be less than twenty-four hours for an interview to work on “The Nightly Show with Larry Wilmore,” but I ended up not boarding the plane back home.

At the time, I’d been doing everything I could to claw my way out of reality television to genres I was more excited about that felt more meaningful to me. You could probably feel the energy radiating off of me in that interview that my soul needed this job. The senior producer (Tonya) who interviewed me said they loved me and if I wanted the job, I had to start the next day.

So, I cancelled my plane ticket back to LA, extended my hotel stay, called my boss in Los Angeles (on the show I was working on at the time as an assistant editor), and very apologetically quit while I was in a cab on my way to buy some clothes (as all I had with me were my interview dress, plus yoga pants and a t-shirt for the plane). I let my roommate know that I’d pay my part of the rent until we could find somebody to replace me, but we should get on that ASAP, in case she had any ideas of someone she wanted to bring in. I also told her I’d either be paying someone to get my stuff, or I’d just come back on some weekend(s) and pack up. I got everything squared away as quickly as I knew how, signed a new lease in New York within two weeks, and I stayed at Nightly ’til the show was cancelled. I got promoted within six months from assistant editor to editor. I got great mentorship and was treated so incredibly well. I made meaningful media and built up a portfolio that’s helped me continue to get a number of great jobs since. Taking that job on a whim, and just figuring it out, changed the course of my life.

Side note: I actually told Jon Stewart that on the last day and his response was better than I could’ve imagined; it was literally one of the best days of my life: On the day we taped the last episode of “The Nightly Show,” I was handing out thank-you cards to everyone on staff. When I got to Jon [Stewart (an executive producer of the show)], I looked at him with tears in my eyes and said, “You don’t need me to tell you all this, since you’ll see it in the card, but you’ve changed my whole life; I dreamt of working for you on a political show that puts good in the world and helps propel things forward, and I actually got to do it. I even got promoted here from assistant editor to full editor. I’m so proud of the work we’ve done, and I’ve loved every moment. So, thank you so much for changing my life.” He looked at me and said, “Thank you, Aurora, but no. You changed your own life. Every person in this building is here because they are some of the best at what they do, and that includes you. It was your talent, your creativity, your tenacity that changed your life. It wasn’t me.”

(And then, nearly ugly crying, I asked if we could take a selfie. He very kindly obliged… And it’s my phone background to this day.)

Regardless of how my life changed with that show, it certainly did change. Working on a late-night comedy show imbued me with a level of respect people just started automatically heaping upon me, and it extended available possibilities (like meetings I couldn’t get before that people were now happy to grant) that I’d never felt so viscerally before. The world opened up wider – because I said yes.

Life is oftentimes found in the yeses. And sure, saying yes can sometimes wind up getting you smacked in the head. And as much as I haaaate the feeling of the metaphorical pavement whacking me in the nose and forehead as my face splats on the ground when I fall face-first into it if something works out poorly, I’d still rather experience as much of life as I possibly can, even if that means doing it bruised and bloody, than to sit daintily at home and settle for less than what can be.

Alright, so let’s move onto what keeps you busy professionally?
My passion is storytelling that changes the world. And I know that sentence is a little silly, like ‘oh, do I think I’m changing the whole world (especially through media)?’ But even just changing one person changes the world. (And so many of us have a story of a movie or TV show we felt changed us.) (The butterfly effect is so real.)

I’ve worked on a lot of shows that tackled social justice issues head-on, like late night political shows where we spotlighted issues like food deserts, gun violence, women’s rights, and more. I was an editor on a television special (“Bear Witness, Take Action 2: Continuing the Movement”), executive produced by LeBron James, focused on systemic racism (with some attention paid to the importance of intersectionality). I also edited and produced on “The Carlos Watson Show,” where I got to be involved in the research and packaging of deep dives on figures I loved learning even more about like Debbie Allen and Anita Hill. (I helped make a whole bunch of good ones, including Pete Buttigieg, Gretchen Whitmer, Cory Booker, Mike Greenberg, and Jalen Rose. (I lived in Indiana for part of elementary school; go Pacers!)

So, I would say I’m extremely proud of working on shows spotlighting social justice issues. However, I don’t think all great work has to tackle issues so directly, head-on, and explicitly. Media that changes the world can include just telling a compelling story that makes someone feel more empathy toward someone else, or inspires a person in new ways through the human experience.

I’ve worked on a wide variety of things and I have so much more I want to work on!

In answer to the question of was it easy, I’d say decidedly not haha, at least for some parts, but some have been very lucky (which I guess is maybe an element of ease (and I do recognize my privilege and know that even though some things have seemed pretty darn hard, there are elements of ease just in some of the things baked into my life).

As far as elaborating on that and how I got to where I am today… since we have nearly unlimited space, I’ll give a longer version for any curious person on a particularly long subway ride or who’s otherwise ready for a semi-deep dive; let’s get into it!

I knew I wanted to work in the arts for as long as I can remember. I went to a performing-arts focused high school (or at least, you could make it arts-focused if you wanted; it offered a whooole lot). We did 10-12 productions a year. (I was in a bunch; in just one of the years, I had a large role in 4 different musicals, including one of them being a one-woman show (“Tell Me On a Sunday”) (that Bernadette Peters had done on Broadway).) We also had 4 different levels of bands and choirs (for the most part not separated by grade level; I was 1st chair saxophone of the highest band (in a pretty large school) my sophomore year ;)). I did all the extra stuff too – All-State choir, honor bands at colleges around the state, acting in some local shows, and playing music as part of a collaboration with the city’s Symphony Orchestra.

I interned with Clear Channel Entertainment (which I believe is now iHeartMedia), and got to go behind-the-scenes with some awesome touring artists when they came to Germain Amphitheater. I also interned with the Columbus Association of Performing Arts and got to go around on the local press junket with the Rockettes while they were in town, which was so fun! (I also got to see some free opera and other cool events. (You know, thinking back on it, I don’t think the people at either of these internships actually made me do that much, if I’m being for real haha. Even though they were officially internships, it was a little more like hang-out ships – but I’ll always take any excuse to hang out around artists, learn more, be inspired, and have fun.) I also did some DJ shadowing at our local radio station (WNCI) (and they were oh so nice to me, and funny, there).

I also loved doing a summer camp at Juilliard. And I got my Equity card as a teenager. I basically lived and breathed all things arts.

The day after I graduated high school, I had a graduation party, and the day after that I moved to New York for the summer to work at a theater that covered my room and board (and as that summer season was ending, I worked on some festival shows as well while I was in New York). Then in the fall, I started at Berklee College of Music (in Boston). Right away, I began working in local theaters, sometimes on stage, sometimes behind-the-scenes. I also bussed to New York sometimes for a part-time internship in a Broadway producer’s office. In the winter, I even got to fill-in on one of his Off-Broadway shows! (There was a part that (to my knowledge) didn’t have an understudy (or if it did, they couldn’t be there for some reason), and the show needed an Equity actress to jump onstage. Having gotten my Equity card so quickly came in super handy in that situation, as I was ready to leap in! And they were basically like ‘sure, you’re here, get onstage.’ I had an Off-Broadway debut on a whim! (Potential running theme here haha, of putting yourself in as many good situations as you can and saying “yes, me!” every time it’s possible.) It went great and was super fun and I continued working with them for a bit. But living with one foot in New York and one in Boston was a slightly strained situation… and then – I got my first TV job in Boston.

Later, in the spring – March (2009) – in Boston, I saw a Craigslist add, with almost no detail whatsoever, just that they needed PAs (production assistants) for an unnamed reality show. It could’ve been a total scam for a nonexistent ‘show’, but I was like ‘whatever, I’m gonna assume it’s not a scam, and if it is, I’ll just be scammed then.’ But sure enough, it was real! And I got to work on “America’s Got Talent’s” Boston auditions! (I was always looking everywhere for everything – trying to get aaaaany job that could get me aaaany closer to the arts/the entertainment industry in general and how lucky that I found a random Craigslist post that got me involved on such a big show.) Initially, I (along with all the other local PAs) was only hired for two days (the short time they were in town).

They need so many PAs to successfully run the auditions. There are multiple audition rooms running at once, and they need PAs at each one, both inside the room taking notes and outside the room helping with contestant flow in and out of the room. They need PAs walking groups of contestants from bigger waiting rooms to the small waiting areas outside these individual audition rooms. They need PAs helping with check-in, collecting all the paperwork, doing wristbands, plus even just some floaters for when another PA has to use the bathroom. They need PAs everywhere, ready to do everything. It’s a huge operation and they can’t really fly an entirely full plane of PAs to different cities every week. It’s more cost effective to just hire a large group of locals in each city.

Since PAs can be doing anything, it would’ve been totally possible to be assigned a position doing paperwork where I never had any interaction with the producers, do my job well, and go home. But I was lucky enough to be assigned to take notes for one of the senior producers (Elyse). I can’t overstate how much I cared about doing as close to perfect of a job as I knew how, and thankfully she loved that enthusiastic intenseness, and the way I took notes and paid rapt attention. She asked if I wanted to come take notes for her again in New York (since it was so close by). Sure, I did! I was always trying to build that resume (plus, it was a fun time and she was someone great to work for). So, I went to New York to work as a PA for the auditions there. Then I ended up working basically all the auditions for the rest of the season.

When I mentioned earlier that some things have been lucky, this was one of those times; one woman (Elyse) was able to jumpstart my career because she liked how studiously I took notes for her. If I had, on my own, told the production manager, “I’d like to work on more of these!” I don’t know that would have swayed anyone doing the hiring. Plenty of people want more work all the time. But because I was randomly paired with the right person, and I did well in her eyes, and she had power to say ‘bring her back,’ I got to come back. Over and over again to different cities.

That summer, they didn’t have enough spots for me to work on the show in LA. But that was for the best, because I had some very serious health issues come up and I’m glad I wasn’t in my first full-time TV job as it happened, because I can only imagine the mess that would’ve been. So, in 2009, I stayed in Boston and went through the summer at Berklee. (I wanted to either finish early, or add as many majors and minors as I could, or both. Spoiler alert: I did not finish anywhere *close* to early, but I did test out of a ton of stuff (about 3 semesters worth of classes through either test outs, or taking classes at local community colleges to count for liberal arts credits), and I finished with 2 majors and 2 minors which is, as of now, the most they allow.)

During that summer semester, I was taken to the hospital after passing out in a class. I was so embarrassed and apologetic and they were like ‘please don’t worry about it, we get college kids passing out all the time. You’re probably just dehydrated. We’ll do an EKG just to be sure all is good and send you on your way’… but the EKG was not all good.

It turned out I had a silent congenital heart defect (a rare form of Wolff-Parkinson-White) I had no idea about, that the doctors said they believe would’ve killed me before I turned 30. I was in and out of the hospital for multiple semesters for different procedures and things, and I tried my best to balance everything and keep moving forward in school (and life). But while around sophomore year of college doesn’t feel sooooo long ago (to me, at least, maybe I’m kidding myself, but if so, I guess just let me haha; let’s not think toooooooo too deeply about the heaviness of the passage of time), it was a shockingly different time.

If there was an office of disability (to help get extensions or excused absences), I didn’t know about it. I was trying to work with individual teachers – some more understanding than others. This was (obviously) pre-pandemic, so zoom wasn’t a big thing. (Okay, I just looked it up and zoom wasn’t a thing at all; it’s so funny, I remember in 2009/2010, some older people in my life thinking we were living in the future with so much happening online, etc., and now here we are with it sounding like the stone age. (Thank god I read Madonna’s dermatologist’s book to know to always wear sunscreen and hats to try to extend any youth I can for as long as I can ;)). But aaaaaaaaaaaanyway, there was a struggle with being in the hospital so much. I missed a *lot* of class. Some teachers let me make up every assignment and didn’t count attendance at all. Some… did not. (I literally failed – with a big fat F on my report card – one of my classes. But I did well enough in many of my classes for them to at least count toward graduation, even if they didn’t look pretty.)

So, to the health stuff: doctors went into my heart a number of times. They tried different things like multiple catheter ablations that kept failing, and an epicardial ablation that failed as well. I even got a blood clot on my heart after one of them. (My understanding is they thought that was caused by just too much irritation to my heart of every however many weeks having wires and burning and everything all up in there.) When several various ablations (with different approaches and by different doctors and even at a couple different hospitals (originally, I was taken in the ambulance to Tufts (which had absolutely amazing hospital food), but eventually things progressed to Massachusetts General) didn’t work (and all complications had been worked out, and I’d gotten off blood thinners), they tried to manage the electrical issue with my heart with medications.

I didn’t really want to be taking medicine for the rest of my life, and the medications were giving me too many side effects anyway, like making my blood pressure tank so low I’d get dizzy all the time, and sometimes even pass out. So, once it seemed like all other options had been exhausted, I ended up having open-heart surgery in 2010, where the chief of cardiac surgery at Mass Gen just went in and cut the extra electrical pathway off my heart.

During this time in ’09-’10, I also continued to try my best to work in local theaters or on TV shows that came to town. Sometimes this was possible as I had times I was out of the hospital. And sometimes this wasn’t, just with so much in-and-out of the hospital. Overall, I like to think I kept a reasonably good attitude. I used to dance to Michael Jackson with the nurses, and tried to find all the fun that was there. But it still was weighing on me that I had to turn down some opportunities after I’d always worked to be early, to be first, to hit the ground sprinting. I thought every second mattered. And man, when you’re in it, it feels that way! (I really empathized with students and early-career professionals during the pandemic as I understood the feeling of a world shutting down and jobs going by the wayside.)

But I got as much done that year as I could (including staying alive). With medical bills piling, and being so tired of being “the heart girl,” I left school to work on “America’s Got Talent” for the summer in LA! I’d kept working with them for my second season that school year, going to audition cities with them whenever I was healthy enough (which seemed to be enough for them to still like me, thankfully). And now, with a longer track record with them (and some turnover in LA of PAs moving on), I had a spot for the whole summer in Los Angeles! (They started the summer tapings just after I was cleared from open-heart surgery. Perfect timing. I was good. to. go.)

The initial plan was to just be in LA for summer and fall of ’10 (as the show went far enough into the deep summer/early fall that I’d need to take off one fall semester). And I felt I really needed that one semester off (with everything that had happened).

But then, when “America’s Got Talent” was ending, since I had access to the the CBS Television City studio lot, as we filmed there, I just started walking around with my resume to every production office on the lot, asking if they needed someone. Of course most shows were like ‘uh, we’re good’. But all it took was one! And I found that one. “Skating with the Stars” was staffing up and hired me as a PA. Then one job basically led into the next (ish) after that.

Sometimes being able to afford to live and everything was touch-and-go (as TV can be), especially in those beginning jobs because PA-level jobs don’t pay so great (the saving grace is how much overtime you get). But there were thiiiiin times between jobs (e.g. subletting out a couch of a stranger in Hollywood I met on Craigslist, living in a cockroach-infested gym that I had to vacate during the hours it was opened to the public so people wouldn’t know someone lived in a small room there, etc. etc.) as it was hard to save anything back while in bottom-rung-level jobs. I did get a job (working in the story department as a live transcriber/note taker for the story producers) on a show called “Model Latina,” which paid for our room and board for something like six weeks in Vegas, which was a real lifesaver, as my salary from that time helped me have a stronger financial foundation when I came back.

Overall, between about 2010 – 2013, I did a few years working mainly on reality shows. Some reality shows I’ve worked on have been pretty innocuous (like “Dancing with the Stars”) and some on the trashier side. (Not everything has wound up on my IMDb page and I feel good about that; we don’t need to remember every single show haha.) Sometime around 2013/2014, I got really in a rut. It was great to finally be pretty darn consistently employed, job after job. But I was having a bit of an existential crisis ‘like, legitimately, what am I putting out into the world here?’ I wanted to make art, because like I said, I thought it could add so much to the world!

What’s scary when you believe art can change the world, is that that means you also believe it can change the world for the worse (which in some ways, it has (e.g. I don’t think Donald Trump would be president if he hadn’t been a famous reality star first; platforming him ended up being hella dangerous, and is an example of how media matters)). I worried, that what I was doing, working in reality TV, was perhaps changing the world for the worse – normalizing adults being horrible to each other and handling conflict quite poorly. And that seemed like small potatoes to my biggest worries; I was mostly extremely concerned about the people *on* the show. Sometimes I worked in the field [and/or sometimes I’d work in post, but still be able to see a looooooot of footage of things that happened]. When working in the field, I would meet these contestants who were incredibly nice and respectful, but slowly over the course of the season, it’s like we would break them.

We’d keep people up super late interviewing them, or by keeping things noisy around them, then we’d wake them up super early (even though we didn’t need them that early – we just wanted them to be tired). I worked on a show where we barely kept any food in the house (and the contestants would have to wait around for quite a while to eat), but the house was always stocked with tons of alcohol. We’d make people sleep-deprived, exhausted, starving, and then also make them paranoid with producers taking them aside and saying, ‘so and so said such and such about you’ even if it wasn’t true. So, we’d get these people to be at their very worst and *then* we’d add dramatic music, just the right cuts, and franken-biting (combining words or sentences that aren’t the way they originally were spoken in order to make a new thought) in post, making people look like true villains. And even though we’d get to move on to the next show, I always thought about them going back to their lives after that – what would their partner, parents, bosses, and more think? And how would those people who’d been on shows perceive themselves and would they even remember what was real vs what was constructed in the edit?

Reality show contestants sign basically their whole lives away in the contract, giving permission to manipulate everything as much as the show wants in perpetuity throughout the universe. And as much as I keep saying “we’d” do this and that in the above sentences, because I acknowledge my role in it, at the time, I justified whatever I could, telling myself, “oh, well, I’m just in lower-level assistant-type jobs, I’m not making any of these decisions. I have no power. And if I quit, they’re just gonna get someone else. And I’m just a college dropout. So my options are limited…” I had all these excuses, but whatever you’re a part of, you’re a part of. And it wore on me. So, I cried on the floor of my apartment and was like there *has* to be more to life than this. I googled “what jobs can college dropouts get hired for?” And then I started auditioning to teach workout classes. I even worked on a phone sex hotline for a hot second – anything to be able to feel better about what I was doing with my time for money. This life of cobbling things together, with one foot in the career I’d been building, not wanting to leave entertainment, but one foot out, not loving the type of entertainment I’d been making, wasn’t super stable or sustainable.

And then [bom bom booooooooom] I saw a job listing for “The Nightly Show with Larry Wilmore” (which was going to be executive produced by Jon Stewart). Talk about people who make media for good!

I couldn’t *believe* there was an actual job posting for this! So many of these jobs are kind of just done behind the scenes, with friends recruiting friends if ever a job opens up on a late-night comedy, or otherwise coveted, show. But the woman who was hiring the post department (Tonya) had been away from New York for a bit and my understanding was that she felt she wasn’t as plugged in as she had been while living there, so she posted it on StaffMeUp, which I never thought I’d see (a show like that posted on StaffMeUp) (and I thanked my lucky stars that I did!).

I wrote an impassioned cover letter, saying how much I hoped to interview… and I heard nothing. I can’t overstate how desperate I was to get into a genre I loved and to make media I believe in. So, the following week, I wrote, basically begging, like, ‘I know I live in California, but I’ll get on a plane *tonight* if you need me. Please, this would be an incredible honor, like let me interview, I beeeg you’ (not quuuuuuite that outwardly desperate, but tbh, close enough). Thankfully, apparently my email came off normal enough and just on the correct side of the line between desperation and passion, because, on December 10, 2014, I got an email from Tonya granting me a phone interview, saying, “Aurora, Your email is actually well-played. I will admit, I’ve seen and spoke to so many qualified applicants, that the fact I cannot meet you in person was working against you. But, your spirited fight has made me reconsider. Can you chat on the phone sometime between 4:30 and 6:30pm EST tomorrow?”

Of COURSE I could chat whenever she wanted. I’d move around any and everything for this opportunity. So, I gave the best interview I could… And I didn’t get the job. (At first!) They were looking for a junior editor to kind of act as a half-assistant, half-editor. But I’d never been the sole assistant on a show before. And while, on one job (as an assistant editor on “Shahs of Sunset”) I had edited a couple of small bonus things for the web, I’d never genuinely been a full-blown editor before. So, Tonya said that while I made it down to the last couple of candidates and that she really liked me, since the show itself was new, it needed experienced people in the roles to help get this something new off the ground (i.e. it couldn’t be that *both* the show and the people were green at the same time), which I understood.

I tried to keep in touch, and every few months or so, I’d write her about how much I liked one of the recent segments. But I wasn’t really hearing back, and I had to keep on in the meantime. I really didn’t want to leave TV as a whole (though I needed something to change). Luckily, I found work in this time period (2014 – 2015) that I didn’t feel morally weird about. In 2014, I was the post-coordinator for “Project Runway: Threads,” with a super fun group of creative people. (I heard the contestants were treated well on that show, so here’s hoping that was indeed true; knowing the people on it, I feel confident in believing it was.)

Also in 2014-2015, I worked on “Living with the Jacksons” – a very short-lived reality show that was announced, and even had a trailer, but ran out of money before the whole thing could be fully made. It was an extremely skeleton crew. I liked rising to the challenge of being one of only three producers (of any level) on the show (the Executive Producer, the Associate Producer, and me). But it was a lot when things started unraveling.

It’s crazy how in TV some level of chaos is expected, so you never quite know when the chaos is high enough to be meaningful. Then all of a sudden, you’re hearing from your contacts (of places you’ve rented for shoots) that the checks aren’t clearing, despite the fact that you’ve been told you have the budget. A number of us didn’t even get paid for our last handful of weeks.

To my knowledge, this was not the actual Jacksons fault. I think just a lot went wrong above my pay grade. It was still a completely worthwhile experience, even if it was a little messy; I cannot overstate how much of a Michael Jackson fan I am. As a kid, I must’ve watched “Michael Jackson Live in Bucharest: The Dangerous Tour” a million times over. Seeing the spectacle he put on showcasing his exceptional talent, it was the initial thing that made me want to get into the entertainment industry.

Once, while on “Living with the Jacksons,” one of the Jacksons called me and I had forgotten Michael Jackson was my ringback tone! (where a song would play as people waited for you to answer.) Anyway, they were like “Oh, that’s so nice of you to make Mike your ringback tone – really getting into the show, huh?” And it’s like…. um… yep. For sure. Exactly that. Just… excited about the show… Not that I’ve idolized that man since I was in diapers and accidentally forgot he’s been my ringback tone for as long as I could have one…” 😉 So, to say working on that show was right up my alley is an understatement.

(And *generally* I feel less ethically weird about reality shows with celebrities because celebrities (usually) have both a better understanding of reality shows, and also more power when it comes to them, than the average person does)

Also, side note: I chose Berklee basically because Quincy Jones (Michael Jackson’s producer) went there. I was so sure I was gonna work for Michael Jackson someday, and with him dying (on my birthday, by the way!!!) while I was at the school I was inspired to go to because his producer went there, well, this was the closest I could get in this timeline. I tried to make sure I treated the family with the utmost respect and chill-ness (and like normal people). Not like there was even any time for fan-girling, even if I wanted. With such a skeleton crew, I was handling a looooot. I’d wake up in a cold sweat at 3am, checking my emails for last minute requests or issues. So yeah, that was a certainly a memorable time.

When that show imploded, I was still in this very restless place, deeply wanting more out of my career. (I mean, 2014/2015 had brought a little more. I seemed to be getting somewhere, with more responsibility and shows that felt better to work on, but still. I wanted more, more.)

Cut back to what was going on with “The Nightly Show.” So, I’d been sending these emails every few months to Tonya (the amazing person I’d interviewed with). I was worried I was coming across as annoying instead of actually building any kind of connection. I worried about falling onto the wrong side of the desperate/passionate line. So, I decided I’d send one last one and if I still didn’t hear back, I’d try to just let it go. But this time, in September of 2015, I did hear back! She granted me an interview. And at the time, I happened to be working a Tuesday – Saturday night shift schedule at my job in LA (as an assistant editor on “Swamp People.” So, it was easy to fly in to NY on a Sunday with the idea that I’d interview on Monday (September 28, 2015), and fly back Monday night with nary a skipped step to my normal routine.

But in that Monday interview, I got the job!!! Tonya said if I wanted the job I had to start the next day, and I didn’t even consider not taking it. How could I not take it?

I obviously felt bad about leaving the show in LA in a bit of a lurch. I *especially* felt bad because my boss in LA was the woman who’d given me my first assistant editor job back in 2011 (also on “Swamp People”). Now here I was working with her again, years later, on another season of the show, showing her no reciprocal loyalty in this moment. Granted, the show was not on a crazy fast turnaround schedule, and there were plenty of AEs (assistant editors) in LA looking for work. And she was well-connected. So, I’m sure she had someone up and running shortly and that ultimately everything was fine. But still. I felt bad. She was *incredibly* nice on the phone call, though. She basically was like, ‘look, you know you’re burning a bridge; I won’t be able to hire you again after this, since it’s such an unreliable action to leave with no notice. That being said, this is an incredible opportunity. You can’t pass it up. I don’t blame you at all. I’m rooting for you out there, and wishing you the best!’ Straightforward, reasonable, fair, but so gentle and positive.

You’ve already heard about some of the biggest highlights from this job in the first answer of this interview (if you can remember that far back at this point haha), so you already get the gist – incredible job, incredible people, luckiest break of my life thus far. Greatest job ever (thus far). And speaking of ‘greatest evers,’ funnily enough, that was the next show I got hired on! – “Greatest Ever” on TruTV, which was a blast. (Yet again, I had a fantastic boss who made work really fun.)

As we were completing that show’s the final episode, I got a stint on “The Daily Show” which I did until I started working on the sketch show “Grown & Sexy” (originally called “Talk Thirty To Me” but my understanding was they couldn’t clear the name through legal (no matter how catchy it is)) for Vh1. It paid a lot more, had very relaxed hours, was union so it came with all the great benefits, and the offices were gorgeous with floor-to-ceiling windows. So, it was a great job. I had co-workers who were a total hoot and so fun to work with. Then alas, it got cancelled.

I finally moved back to LA(!), which has my heart always. (We’re in about 2018 or so now.) I cobbled together a bunch of random jobs. I got to do a short stint editing on Will Smith’s social media which was rad. They invited me back for more. But the office was soooooo far away from my apartment. I felt like I was spending my life commuting. (If only this had been a couple of years later when remote work was in!) And I had another, longer-term, job on the table for Tastemade, so I did that instead.

(Sometimes I think not taking an extension with Will Smith’s company was a really dumb choice, but I’m also thinking that while I have the clarity afforded to me of a brain that’s not in the middle of commuting a million hours a day haha.) I feel like we left on good terms, as I didn’t even “leave,” I just worked my initial agreement and then didn’t sign on for an extension. And I’d love to do anything there again sometime should the opportunity ever present itself!

As you can maybe tell from my story, sometimes it could be a struggle to pick between things you loved and wanted to work on vs things that had various better perks, whatever those may be from money to life ease (but of course, that’s an exceptionally lucky time when more than one offer is on the table at once). The best jobs are the ones where you don’t have to choose. “Nightly” had it all, as did several other shows I’ve worked on (e.g. “Bear Witness,” “Carlos Watson,” and more). But when you are choosing between better perks vs more meaningful media, I don’t think I have an absolute-always-works rule-of-thumb. You gotta kinda take each situation as it goes with the variables it presents (e.g. *how* much extra does it pay, or *how* many hours of commute does it save you, or *how many* more months (or years) does it keep you employed? I can’t imagine I would take something that I viewed as truly abhorrent, no matter the pay. But if it’s a neutral job that maybe isn’t tackling world issues, but also isn’t doing anything bad, then you have to balance your needs with how much you think you are or are not helping the world (and balance *how* world-changing the thing is you’re deciding against).

So, from 2018 – early 2020, I bounced around on the aforementioned gigs, plus I was the lead editor on a fun little beauty talk show (“Beauty and Bubbles”) until it ended in February of 2020, and then before you know it, we’re hurling into the 2020 Covid-19 pandemic.

Obviously it was an extraordinarily difficult time for so many people, so I hope it doesn’t come off tone deaf to be like, ‘but look at the great stuff that happened!’ (And I certainly had some difficulties during that time as well.) But two areas in which it worked out quite well for me were:
1) School-wise. This was about 10 years after I’d initially dropped out. So, at that point, I just kind of thought I’d never finish; graduating didn’t seem wholly important anymore. But one of my professors (Kevin – they’re laid back and generally go by first names at Berklee), from when I’d been there 10 years ago, reached out and said I should really consider finishing. He said if I ever wanted to go back, right now was the time, as I wouldn’t have to move back to Boston, and Berklee likely would never be going remote again. So, I thought why not, and jumped on the opportunity. I re-enrolled for the summer 2020 semester, and I went for the rest of the time Berklee was remote (summer and fall 2020 and spring and summer 2021 (I figured I should learn all I could while I could.)). I officially graduated in August 2021 with a degree in Music Production & Engineering and Electronic Production & Design with minors in Creative Coding and Sound Design for Video Games.
(I ended up going straight into a one-year master’s at Berklee as well in Creative Media & Technology from the fall of 2021 through the summer of 2022 (when they invited me to be part of the inaugural class of their new program in NYC).)

2) Work-wise! You would think the pandemic wouldn’t be such a great time for work in the entertainment industry. (I know for many it wasn’t, and I feel so much empathy for those who had a supremely rough go of it). I was really stressed at the beginning (and during certain slower parts) like, ‘oh my gosh, how are we going to make TV? People can’t be around each other!’ But before you know it, I got to edit on my first cartoon. (It was called “Your Daily Horoscope” for the short-lived platform Quibi.) Obviously cartoons could be made fully from people’s homes, just sharing files around, putting it all together. So, that worked out as a great relatively early pandemic job. Then I got to work as an editor/story producer on the talk show “The Carlos Watson Show” which did a great job of figuring out how to make the set (and show as a whole) successfully look great while interviewing over zoom.

“The Carlos Watson Show” is another example of something being a *little* chaotic by the time it’s trickled down to you, but not really knowing the acceptable level of chaotic, or the depth and breadth of issues until something blows up a little more. The crew was a bit smaller on that one and I had tons of responsibility on my episodes, really building and refining them. I was trying to see if I could work my way into a higher-level producer position while I was there and thank goodness I never became a higher-level producer there! (Google “The Carlos Watson Show fraud” and you can read all about it.) I’m glad I was never close enough to know anything that was going on in that realm. I just really thought like, ‘oh, we thought we were gonna air on A&E and now we’re not, but pretty much whatever network should be fine as long as we’re making good stuff and the checks are clearing.’) Little did I know what all was going on.

On our end though, one crazy thing that happened there is that I think all(?) the editors were let go at the end of the first season, because editors are a pretty big expense and they wanted to try to outsource(?) the show (or maybe hire college students for less, or whatever their plan was to save money on editors). With *as much* work as I did to really put together my episodes from the raw footage of long interviews (plus doing research and finding archival footage for the packages, writing VO, really editing down the content, etc.), I was confident they weren’t going to be able to keep the reasonably fast pace and get as good of a product (sorry, hopefully that doesn’t sound like hubris or anything; it’s important to acknowledge when you know you’re bringing really valuable (and reasonably specific) skills!). I’d asked around a bit to find out what other editors were making, because since I thought the show would really need us, I thought they might ask us back, and sure enough, when they did, I wanted to make sure I was making as much as possible. There was only one editor on the team who’d made more than me. (He had a ton more experience and had won an Emmy, so realistically, that was pretty fair.) But now I had a little leverage to try to make it so that no editor was making more than me, as I like to believe that, even though I didn’t quite have his gravitas, I brought a lot to the table (which was going to be even more super evident if they asked me back after thinking (or at least acting like) they didn’t need me). When they inevitably did ask to undo their letting-me-go and bring me back for season two (literally something like a couple of weeks later; nearly no time had passed), I was all, “happily, for [more money]” (which I believed they could pay, since they’d been paying it to someone else). Of course they were like “you literally *just* worked here for less though.” It was wildly satisfying to be able to be like, ‘and it was *your* choice that I’m not working there for that amount of money anymore; yesterday’s price isn’t today’s price!’ It was such an amaaazing feeling to know my worth and stand up for myself! And with the raise I did indeed get, I came right back for another season.

As the second season was winding down (in the first half of 2021), it was really unclear if a third season was happening, and I kind of felt like it was an appropriate time to be done (especially as things had started to come undone a bit more as the second season continued on). So, I moved on to working on a show for Ava DuVernay. (And I felt like I got out of Carlos Watson at just the right time. (Again, google up the fraud case if you want more details. (And of course I know he’s so much more than just that one case. He was really nice in any interactions I had with him and he seemed totally smart. So, I don’t think of any of this as like ‘yeah look at that fraudster!’ or anything like that. We made great episodes of TV. I had a great time and was paid well. It’s disappointing that it all went down the way it did. That’s just seemingly a relevant part of the story, is all.) But anyway, with getting out at the right time around the end of season 2, luck, again, was on my side there.)

In winter of 2020, while I was still working on “Carlos Watson” (and going to school), I also was an editor on the special I mentioned at the beginning of this answer (again, if you can remember back that far! haha) executive produced by LeBron James (called “Bear Witness, Take Action 2: Continuing the Movement”) (which I loved doing!). And in that same vein of social justice luminaries, in 2021, I got to work on a show (“Home Sweet Home” for NBC) executive produced by Ava DuVernay (how cool!) (which only ran for the one season I was on it).

Then toward the end of 2021 and into 2022, as the Ava Duvernay show wound down, and the world kind of re-opened, I still got to work remotely for a while on some talk shows. For instance, I was a digital editor on “The Good Dish” until it was cancelled. Later in 2022 (through mid-2024), I started working as a post-production supervisor on a group of Martha Stewart shows for Roku (“Martha Cooks,” “Martha Gardens,” and “Martha Holidays” (which are pretty self-explanatory as to what they were about ;))).

For anyone who’s thinking to themselves ‘weren’t the SAG-AFTRA and WGA strikes happening in that time period?’ Yes, and I would *never* cross a picket line! Since we were unscripted instructional shows not under WGA contracts (and with no WGA writers), we weren’t a show the WGA was striking. And Martha Stewart was under the Network Code SAG-AFTRA contract for hosting that was not part of the contracts being renegotiated at the time of the SAG-AFTRA strike. SAG-AFTRA members under contracts that weren’t striking at that time were encouraged to continue their obligations and keep working. So, we listened to union membership and kept going because of the very specific niche area we fit into. But I did consistently go join the picket lines to show solidarity with my fellow TV makers!

One funny thing from that job is that I feel like many people think of Martha Stewart as having very ‘feminine’ shows, but I walked into a job with an entire editing staff of men. I had a lot of fun with the guys (and we talked fantasy football at nearly every morning meeting during the season)… I’m still in a fantasy football league with my then-boss from the Nightly Show (and now-friend) Tonya. I really thought being around these guys who knew and cared so much would help me in the season… but I did worse than I’d ever done hahahahaha. I still had a lot of fun with the guys though (who I do not blame one bit for me never knowing which flex players to play)! And there’s always next year!

When those Martha shows were cancelled, as I was working my last weeks on them, I got a job on a syndicated show called “Battleground,” covering the “battleground” states of the 2024 election. Talk about an ethical conundrum!

When I was hired, I was stoked to get a job immediately (during the cancellation of the one(s) I was working on) without any break in my working stride (especially with the ebbs and flows of the industry (both in general, and how it’s been in the recent years)). And I looooove working on political shows. I was hesitant when they said they were just going to be neutral, down the center, not leaning toward any side – because anyone who is not outspokenly against Trump is empowering him. But I *hoped* that neutral could mean expressing things as they actually are, including Trump being dangerous and unqualified. (Yes, he’s been president before and those of us still here made it through that, but that doesn’t mean he’s qualified; and he’s *highly* unqualified to be a *good* president.)

So, I started on the show and it was center-ish for a bit. Then it started leaning more and more right and we had an ecosystem that became almost comical – the higher-ups would give edicts to those making the episodes that the show should be more right-leaning. So those hands-on in making the product would book more right-leaning people, do more right-leaning subjects, and try to have more and more right leaning viewpoints seeping in to this “center” show. But as the supervising post-producer/lead editor, I was the last person to touch the episodes.

So, I would puuuuuuuuull the show back in from being right-leaning, like ‘nope, not gonna say that’ [snip, snip, snip]. And then the show would air as a reasonably neutral show ((as much as I could help it), and is technically what I agreed to make, by the way!). Then, as far as what I heard, the higher-ups would tell the EP (executive producer) that the show needed to be more right-leaning. So, they’d pull it *further* right, and I’d yank it even *harder* back to center in the edit. As much as it’s horrifying to be working on anything right-leaning, so I’m hesitant to tell this story with too much levity, it also was a little hilarious to be stuck in that loop where it must’ve seemed so confusing to some, like no matter how right-leaning they made the show, the higher-ups still wanted it even further right-leaning (but that’s, at least in part (and maybe largely), ‘cause it went through me first). Obviously I could only do so much. I couldn’t literally create new guests from scratch. But I could *certainly* tone it waaaaay down. And I struggled a *lot* with whether it was ethical to work on that type of show. (I just about puked in the midst of my tears (about covering the horrific outcome and aftermath of the 2024 election) when they were quoting *Regan* on our final episode, propping him up someone to glorify.) But, I’d ultimately decided that since I had so much autonomy in the edit and a fair amount of influence on the final show, I thought I was doing better in there than I would’ve been doing not there at all (as I genuinely think it would’ve been a different show had someone else been in my chair). I hope that was the correct ethical choice, but sometimes, it’s hard to know. (And I wouldn’t say the show ever became truly explicitly pro-Tr*mp, because there certainly would’ve been a line where I would’ve walked away, no matter what good I thought I was doing there. But did I draw the correct line? Who knows. Here’s hoping so.)

Now, I started all this by answering the part of the question that asked was it easy, with me saying it was not. And you might’ve read all this (if you’ve read this far haha, and if so hello!) and thought ‘what sounds hard about that? Seems like you’ve worked pretty consistently, gotten lucky breaks multiple times, and it wasn’t all that hard at all.’

But I’ve mainly only talked about things that happened, not the things that didn’t happen – the opportunities that felt almost within my fingertips that then faded away. One of the things that I think has been hardest is that in some ways, it’s too often felt like every time I’ve started truly getting my footing with things really going great, boom! Something happens.

I’ve always dreamt of doing more; I like to write and act and sing and all that as well. And before I had all my health issues in undergrad, I was doing some acting and dancing and thought I was kind of ‘on my way’. But then my health came front and center and there was a lot I couldn’t do anymore (at least for that time being). I got pretty darn out of shape as I wasn’t allowed to exercise while they figured things out (and initial treatments kept seeming to fail). When I *finally* had gotten my health back completely (and my financial health too), I got “The Nightly Show!” I moved to New York! I performed in little readings and things and started auditioning more. There I was thinking I was on my way again.

Then I was sexually assaulted (at a place totally unrelated to my amazing job, just to be clear) not too long after moving. I often felt super alone as I’d left my people, and favorite places (hiking trails, museums, improv theaters, vegan restaurants, gymnastics gym, etc.), and everything else in Los Angeles. I was diagnosed with PTSD after that and I had a reeeeeeally hard time even just functioning. I didn’t take the subway for the longest time after that happened – I couldn’t bear to be touched by anyone, even if it was just someone accidentally bumping into me. I had so many nightmares and therefore sooooo much trouble sleeping, so I was constantly sleep deprived; I was a walking mess much of the time and it’s a *miracle* that I didn’t get fired with how much I was falling apart. (I preeeeeeeeetty much kept it together (ish) through the end of Nightly, but by the time I got to “Greatest Ever,” I was really losing the ability to keep my life under control. Thank goodness for the extremely flexible hours and exceptionally understanding boss, because I basically couldn’t stay on any kind of even normal (ish) schedule with how much I couldn’t sleep and could barely function.)

I went to SO much therapy. And I, slowly but surely, got a lot better and got my life under control. In 2019, feeling much better, I threw myself back into dance and acting. I was in class often multiple times a day. I was going back to auditions and starting to get callbacks. And boom. 2020.

I was so determined not to let yet another setback, like the pandemic, get me down – hence the going back to school, and the working all the time. In addition to that, I was trying to write more creative things and I was working out all the time. (The second it was announced that we were going to lockdown, I ordered a treadmill for my apartment, and I used it everyday.) I just thought I *cannot* take another setback.

But unfortunately, I ended up slipping into an abusive relationship in late 2019 (that went off the rails in 2020 and continued through and beyond the pandemic). While I have experienced physical domestic violence, it was – *for me* (and my specific variables) – nearly nothing in comparison to other forms of violence. I have never been sicker (even when I practically lived in the hospital in undergrad!) than I was from the chronic (chroooooonic) insanely intense stress I was under from all the emotional and psychological abuse. The gaslighting was so intense; I hardly knew up from down. In early 2020, I had a stay in the hospital because my EKG resembled that of someone having a heart attack(!) I was under so much stress in that relationship.

I later had to be hospitalized again for several nights due to severe stomach issues after I couldn’t keep anything down for a week, was severely dehydrated, and continued to have trouble even drinking water. (And that feels like it’s just scratching the surface of my health problems over those years.) Over and over, my body was being destroyed mainly from the inside out. My immune system was in the trash, and yet again, I was just a mess (with both PTSD and C-PTSD now).

(And having a huge part of this occurring during the pandemic was even worse because I was so very isolated. Already in abusive relationships, it seems like the abuser becomes the whole world and in this case, since the whole world really did shut down to some extent, it felt even more deeply & intensely that he was (suffocatingly so) the whole world.

Being this sick and this stressed definitely did affect my working (and personal) life – especially because I couldn’t even articulate what was going on for the longest time (and am still not sure that I know exactly how). So, if I couldn’t see and articulate my own problems, how could I expect anyone else to understand? (And it was made even harder by the fact that people overall were so kind and patient with my initial PTSD diagnoses from being sexually assaulted, so how did I let *another* man destroy part of me/at least a chapter of my life? (It’s like that TikTok sound from Phineas and Ferb, “2 nickels, which isn’t a lot, but it’s weird that it happened twice.”) That was so embarrassing that it made it even harder to speak about, when I barely knew how to speak about it in the first place.

I guess I’ve been making it through in some way or another, but I guarantee you that along the way there’ve been people I’ve met on gigs who must have wondered, “what is that girl’s deal?” It negatively affected my ability to build and maintain relationships, both personal and professional. And that’s really been a bummer (and increased some of the issues with isolation). Tbh, I feel like I’m still, to this day, clawing my way back to a life I love living.

And so all that to say, sometimes, it feels like every time things seem to be on a great track, I have a life-altering setback. And that has been the hardest part. It’s literally almost made me afraid to try to make things good again, if every time I do, a metaphorical astroid crashes into me. However, I have to dream and I have to try. And now I’m trying to see what’s next. Sorry, hope I didn’t get too deep there. Just trying to thoroughly answer everything (maybe too thoroughly; who knows who’s still reading, but hello if you are! haha)

Outside of my television career, I care deeply about politics. I’ve volunteered for candidates like Hillary Clinton, Elizabeth Warren, and Kamala Harris. And you can’t forget to stay active in the midterm years(!) (like when I canvassed for Aftab Pureval while visiting my grandma in Cincinnati).

I also enjoy traveling. I’ve been to a bunch of different countries. I worked on a show in Mexico for some months. I also went to Morocco for several weeks for the fun of it. I won a trip to Barbados on “Wheel of Fortune,” which was the trip of a lifetime! I’m a certified Rescue Diver in scuba diving, so I love being in the ocean, and I’m ready to save your life, if ever you should need me to!

Additionally, I’ve been pretty into running! I’ve done over a hundred half-marathons, a handful of marathons, and a few ultra-marathons. I’ve also done some long-term running projects for charity, like when I ran “Project 882” – 882 race miles representing the 882 Americans sexually assaulted every day, while raising money for domestic violence charities like the Crime Victims Treatment Center in New York and Peace Over Violence in Los Angeles. I also ran “52 Half Marathons in 52 Weeks (After Open-Heart Surgery)” raising $6,300 for Broadway Impact.

Wrapping up the questions (if you can believe it after all this yapping! haha) (But making sure I try to answer each part.) As far as lessons learned along the way – if people are reading my lessons for advice, I think the biggest piece of advice I could give is that every single piece of advice (not just from me, but anywhere) comes with an asterisk, because even advice that normally doesn’t work will have some cases where it does (and vice versa). There is so much I still haven’t experienced, and so many nuanced situations… I don’t know more than I know. I know what’s worked (and what hasn’t) in my exact life as it’s turned out thus far, and, sure, we can try to extrapolate some of that. I’m sure some can be relevant to other things, but certainly not all of it. So don’t take anything I (or really anyone) has to say as total gospel.

As far as other pieces of advice, I know this is kind of a trite thing to say, but I think being yourself is important. For instance, I can (clearly) be kind of a lot. For instance, with as persistent and passionate as I was about getting a job on “The Nightly Show,” some people would’ve hated that and felt I was pushing too hard and been turned-off by it. But my boss there enjoyed the a-lot-ness (as far as I can tell; after all, we are still friends). If she hadn’t, it wouldn’t have been the right place for me anyway, so I might as well show who I am and be who I am from jump. And this was true not just in that job, but in several of them. Think about the first job I had. I was asked if I wanted to stay on longer because my boss there loved me enthusiastic intenseness. ‘Enthusiastic intenseness I think really probably is my essence/my vibe. The people who love it, love it. And that’s where I thrive.

Similarly, you haaaaaaave to go with your soul for the things you wanna do. I almost said “go with your gut” (and I have said that before). But I think people can sometimes mistake “gut” to just mean “impulse.” And I don’t mean it that way. I don’t mean go with your first thought. I mean, listen to the depths of your soul for what you reeeeeeally want, and do that. Because if things don’t go well – if a show is panned, if you lose some money – like if things just in one way or another don’t go well, it is WAY easier to take it on the chin and kinda be like “well, I tried my best” or “that made the most sense at the time” if it *really* was the idea you wanted/the best you had in you at the time, than it is if something you *already didn’t wanna do* goes poorly. Because then you have that extra level of “I KNEW it! And now I’m suffering the consequences *twice* – once for the initial engagement in the thing I didn’t even wanna do in the first place, and then for the fallout from the thing I already didn’t like doing. Not worth it.

Live trying to chase positive outcomes instead of trying to avoid regret. I’d also say as far as lessons that one thing that’s insanely important is like you *cannot* give up. The industry can be brutal sometimes, but truly part of the secret to making a life in it is just being willing to continue on when other people call it a day. It’s being willing to take that 100th (thousandth, ten-thousandth) rejection and go back in again next week. You gotta actually (choose to) stay to have staying power.

I’d also say that while I’ve had some lucky breaks, and luck *for sure* plays into levels of success – Luck can’t materialize if you don’t put yourself in the spots where it lives. If you want to get more luck, you gotta grab it! This was evident like when at “The Nightly Show,” the post-production staff went out to lunch on a Friday (the day we didn’t tape shows) and when an editor asked to have a day off to attend a field shoot, I asked if I could be the one to fill in for her. Sure enough, I got to fill in.

I had started in September 2015 as an assistant editor. On January 21, 2016, I got to do that fill-in day, thinking it would just be a cool experience. But, when a different editor left shortly after for personal family reasons, since I had just filled in and it had gone great, I got to start a trial period (on February 11, 2016) for becoming the new editor. And on March 14, 2016 (less than six months after I started on the show), I officially, permanently, got promoted to editor, and I edited on the show ’til it went off the air.

The day the group went to lunch, I could’ve stayed in and eaten at my desk, but I went to lunch. I could’ve sat there quietly and let them figure out some editor to fill in on the day Amanda was out, but I asked if I could do it. Yes, luck can kind of just sneak up on you and be shot like an arrow at your life, but luck is not necessarily hyper-precise, you gotta give it the biggest target to aim at that you possibly can.

As far as what sets me apart from others… hmmm… I like to think I have extraordinarily high levels of tenacity. And I almost think you have to, because even I struggle with not letting my tenacity get dulled down with certain setbacks and just, *gestures around at everything* and such. So, if you have extremely high levels, then even if, at points, it’s depleting, you have enough to still keep going, and to try to build that tenacity bank back.

I think another thing that sets me apart is like, I’m down to do things, I’m down to try. For instance, every year, I do something for my birthday I’ve never done before. I’ve been bungee jumping, flown a helicopter (in a lesson, under the supervision of a real helicopter pilot), eaten fire, gone on a police ride-along, been trapeze-ing; I’ve been diving with bull sharks. I like to live. So, I’m down for practically whatever’s happening. “Yes” is a remarkably powerful word.

And lastly, what do I want the world to know about my brand and my story?

Well… about my “brand,” I guess I would say that having a brand is something I struggle with sometimes. I know that we’re seemingly all basically supposed to have our own brand and think like a brand. But finding that line of being truly authentic (which is supposedly often a good and helpful thing for your brand… until its not) but not toooooo authentic, ‘real’ but ‘palatable’, opinionated, but not too offensive (or at least offensive to the right people), and just the whole balancing act of everything – knowing exactly what and how to share when and where – being this sort of packaged, careful version that’s meant to *play* as “authentic” (but if it’s toooo packaged can backfire (but can also backfire if it’s not packaged enough)) can be rough. As Tina Fey said on the Las Culturistas podcast, “authenticity is dangerous and expensive.”

I also think one thing I struggle with, re: my brand is that I sometimes I kind of position myself as someone who has taken a lot of hits (metaphorically and literally) and yet still perseveres. For instance, my fantasy football team is called the Los Angeles Callistos because my understanding of Callisto is that it’s a moon of Jupiter that basically gets prettier the *more* it gets hit (because I think it’s covered in ice, so every time it gets hit by things in space, it starts revealing more of the actual planet-like colors and texture beneath the ice). (I’m not a scientist astronomer person, so don’t take that as absolutely for sure true, that’s just like, my limited (could be mis-)understanding of it.) And as much as I think it’s cool in theory to say that like “I can take *anything*! it’s also like a) I don’t know that I want to be known that way, because I don’t want to be packaged in the negative – even if it’s a positive spin on the negative. b) I don’t know that I want to tempt the universe or act like I can take *eeeeeeeverything* because maybe sometimes I can’t. Not everything should need to be so hard, so maybe I want to be in the mindset that everything can work out wonderfully even if I’m not getting hit my space debris.

And about my story, I guess I’d say that I hope there are several more chapters that are (positively) wildly interesting. And in the words of Michael Jackson accepting his World Music Award in 2000, “you ain’t seen nothin’ yet!”

Let’s say your best friend was visiting the area and you wanted to show them the best time ever. Where would you take them? Give us a little itinerary – say it was a week long trip, where would you eat, drink, visit, hang out, etc.
Aaaagh! How exciting to have someone getting to visit one of the best cities in the world for an entire week!

So much pressure to give the best itinerary I can!

I’m gonna start with a few descriptions and thoughts before the itinerary:

Some Quintessential LA things:
1) Television! That’s what this town is often about and there are a bunch of great studio tours. The Sony one is fun and expansive. And for the longest time, on the WB lot, you could sit in a recreation of Central Perk (on the “Friends” couch). I’ve heard that now it may be a recreation of the guys’ apartment on “The Big Bang Theory.” Additionally, you could get tickets to any of the shows that tape in LA like Kimmel. Or you could see a game show and get a chance to be on stage!
2) Gotta hike to the Hollywood sign! (And gotta do the trail that goes *behind* it, because that’s as close as you can get; I like to do the route that passes the wisdom tree.)
3) If we get to strategize what week they come ahead of time, then they’ve gotta do the LA Marathon! In my opinion, that is the *best* way to see LA. It travels through a bunch of quintessential neighborhoods. You get a taste of it all!
4) Café Gratitude. I know it’s technically just a restaurant, but it’s a must-experience restaurant where I take anyone visiting town. It’s truly quintessential LA – vegan and crunchy with their question of the day and ordering the menu as affirmations. It can be hard for some to leave their egos at the door and order in that kind of “silly” way to be like “I am dazzling” to mean you want a caesar salad, but we are dazzling! Why not?
5) Hollywood Walk of Fame, Grauman’s Chinese Theatre (tbh, usually people are a little underwhelmed at the Walk of Fame, since the sidewalks are often kind of dirty, but you still gotta see it.) We’d look up whoever their favorite celebrity was and make sure to see that one. And imagine if their trip coincided with one of the star ceremonies! That would really be a boon!

One more food thing that felt worth pointing out:
There was a place that used be open by UCLA called Native Foods Café, which I LOOOOOVED – maybe the best vegan food I’ve ever eaten in my life. Unfortunately, it closed, but(!) there’s still one in Palm Springs, and quite honestly, I would probably drive to Palm Springs with a cooler so I can LOAD UP and we could dig in on all things Native Foods when they got here.

Sports:
Whatever someone’s chosen sport is, we’ve probably got it. Seeing Cameron Brink play live would be such a W. LeBron James obviously is a king. And Shohei Ohtani? I mean! (I don’t know enough about some other sports, but I trust that we’re good at basically everything. (My understanding is that USC is the *the* school with the *most* Olympic medal-winning students & alums. So maybe we could even see something there.))

Other notes:
1) For the Magic Castle, I think(?) you gotta know somebody to get in here. The person who took me knows a member. But assuming you can get in (which I believe you can! (you may be able to buy your way in with a dinner ticket or something?), this is really fun (and it’s fun to dress up!).
2) When I mention the Groundlings Theatre, it’s ‘cause I personally love it. They have a bunch of super talented alums like Lisa Kudrow, Will Ferrell, Melissa McCarthy, and Kristen Wiig. Wouldn’t it be fun to see the next big star before others know about them? But the Groundlings isn’t the only great small theater and/or improv theater in LA. So, tons of choices in that realm!
3) I also mention going to the Disney Concert Hall, which I think is worth going to see (at least the architecture if you can’t make it to a show, and walk around the area outside of the building where there’s a little park like in/out of the building where you’re not officially *in* the building, but you are kind of on top of it and behind one of the walls – you’ll see it and get what I’m saying). So, I would do that even if you don’t see a show. But there are sooooo many places you can see a show – the Dorothy Chandler, the Pasadena Playhouse, of course the Hollywood Bowl (which I’ll already be mentioning as an option in the itinerary) and more. (There’s so much to do in LA, I couldn’t possibly list it all… and I know you don’t expect me to. So, let’s get into the best itinerary I know how to make for one week in LA.):

—Saturday night – they fly in. Some will say fly into Burbank, which is less crowded, but I also like LAX! It doesn’t really super matter either way. They come into whichever one they want. And then I greet them with Native Foods Café, as in this scenario, I went to Palm Springs earlier in the day with a cooler and got Native Foods so they could have some, because if you get even within a couple hours of a Native Foods, it’s worth the effort. Then, we basically get straight to bed because –

—Sunday – we’ve got the LA Marathon! (My understanding is that the LA Marathon now ends in Century City which is where my *exceptional* dentist is, so if it weren’t a Sunday, I’d say let’s duck in and visit Dr. Dorfman.)
After the race, it’s time to eat and I think we’d go to In ’n’ Out, because they’re everywhere and you can hardly go to LA and not try In ’n’ Out. (If they need even more food though, after 26.2 miles and all, we maybe also grab something from Carl’s Jr. not tooooo too much later, because if we’re talking LA fast food, Carl’s Jr. is my jam.) Then, we grab a shower and get changed, because it’s time to get dressed up and head to the Magic Castle. It’s relaxed and there’s a lot of sitting and watching shows, so it’ll be a restful experience after the race.

—Monday – Today’s Hollywood Day. Nothing super strenuous after the 26.2 mile race. First, we go to the Price is Right (where there’s a lot of sitting and hanging out throughout the morning). You gotta go to a taping of something while in LA. I love game shows. So, why not go to a taping where you can actually win something? (I actually won a car on The Price is Right!) After that gets out, hopefully they have great news as a game show winner if this is the best week ever.
We’ll do a quick little walk around the Grove if there’s time (since it’s right there at Television City). [Note: I only just found on the day this is going to publication that the Price is Right no longer tapes at Television City! So, I guess we’re going to Glendale in the morning? So, we may skip The Grove since we won’t be right there anymore and it’s an outdoor mall, which a lot of places have. But we can still go to Hollywood after, because Glendale’s not all thaaat far away.]
And then, we eat maybe the most decadent pancakes to ever exist at The Griddle. They’re bigger than the size of your head, come in tons of super sweet flavors, and it’s nearly necessary that you try one.
Then we head to the Walk of Fame and Grauman’s Chinese Theater and the Hollywood & Highland shopping center. If it’s not too late, we’ll do the tour of the Dolby Theatre (with all the Oscar history) while we’re there (or if it is too late and this is really important to the guest, we can switch a couple of things around on the Hollywood days). Then, if we’re hungry, we’ll have a fairly late lunch at Real Food Daily which is craaaaaaazy good vegan food. I’m saving the Groundlings for Wednesday, when we’ll be back in the Hollywood area again. So, for Monday night, as far as the nighttime activity, depending what this person is into, there would be options. I say we go to a sports game of some sort. Dodgers (if the LA Marathon is held late enough March that they’re playing) or Lakers (since I don’t think the Sparks are playing in March). If we see the Dodgers, I’d definitely invite my guest to get a Dodger Dog. (There is an amazing vegan dodger dog that’s like the greatest vegan hot dog of all time.) (Sorry, I know there’s a lot of food stuff and there’s SO much more than food in LA. But I’m just trying to fit everything in and make sure my marathon runner friend never goes hungry. We’ll probably only eat like half or quarter meals. We can split everything, so they can get tastes of deliciousness without getting overly stuffed.)
If we don’t do a sports thing, other things we could do are see a movie at the Hollywood Forever Cemetery if Cinespia is happening (though I think that’s maybe a weekend/summertime only thing?). Also, we’d be close to the Greek Theatre and the Hollywood Bowl if things were playing there that this person wanted to see.

—Tuesday – Okay, we’re starting to get our legs back up to speed because today we’re downtown with a fair amount of walking. We’ll start in kind of the USC area before going to downtown proper. And while we’re there, we’ll do all the great stuff in Exposition Park – the California African American Museum, which has a lot of cool events infused with learning. And we’ll walk over to the California Science Center. We’ll hop into the Natural History Museum (which to my knowledge, still has sleepovers for adults So, if that’s happening during this week, tack that on to any day it’s being offered and we can get there for an overnight adventure).
We’ll pop over to Café Gratitude (one of the best restaurants ever) for a late lunch. Then, we’ll head to kind of ‘downtown proper,’ and maybe check out the Broad museum and walk through the gorgeous downtown LA library and up the Bunker Hill Steps, probably take the Angel’s Flight trolly ‘cause why not? Check out The Last Bookstore sometime in there, and walk around the Disney Concert Hall building (up those side steps to the little park on the top) and check out a show there that night. Then we can wind down with a late-night dinner or snack at LA Café (which has insanely decadent lobster grilled cheese sandwiches for people who eat lobster, but if not, they have soooooooo many options). (Also, at *some* point, either this day or Wednesday night while they’re downtown, we should try to stop at Donut Friend – scruuuumptious vegan donuts! (You’d never know they don’t use dairy in all their cream-filled deliciousness.) Again, we’re just eating like 1/4 to 1/2 of all this food haha and the rest we can give away if anyone on the street would like some as well.)

—Wednesday – This is a big day for Griffith Park (so basically, we’re back to Hollywood). We go to the Hollywood sign (on the route that passes the wisdom tree and goes *behind* the Hollywood sign (since that’s the closest you can get). Then we can refuel at this yummy place called “The Waffle” with tons of breakfast food options from quite healthy to decadent and the restaurant itself is just adorable and comfy. Since we haven’t headed toooooo far out of Griffith Park, we’ll go right back in to go to the Griffith Observatory (or we’ll do the other things listed next first, so it’s a little darker when we go, making it better to look at the sky).
If they want to go to a Warner Brothers tour, this would be a good day to do it, since we’re pretty close to the neighborhood. (So, we’d time our hike to be before or after it; whatever worked). We could also run by LACMA. (People love taking their picture with the streetlights art installation outside. (It’s me; I am people, and I have that pic on my instagram.)) And we could walk around the La Brea Tar Pits while we’re there. And at some point, we go to Roscoe’s Chicken & Waffles on Sunset & Gower, because that’s such an LA staple, how can you not? (Since things on Monday and Wednesday are in the same area, feel free to mix and match as you wish, and anything we wanted to get to on Monday but didn’t – now would be a great time to pick it up.) We’ll head to a show at The Groundlings (I put this on Wednesday, because I truly love The Crazy Uncle Joe Show and that’s the one they do on Wednesdays. But(!) They also have a show on *some* select Mondays called “The Black Version” which stars, among others, one of the teachers I’ve had at the Groundlings – Jordan Black. It’s SO good. So, if that’s playing, maybe we do it on the Monday Hollywood day, whatever works). Then, if we somehow still have room for any more food, we’ll get an after-show hot dog down the street at the famous Pink’s Hot Dogs

—Thursday – It’s time for the beach! Since they got here on a Saturday night and I assume we have exactly a week, that means they’re leaving on a Saturday night. So, if they’re gonna scuba dive, I wanna make sure it’s not too close to when they’re flying, for safety reasons (let’s all avoid decompression sickness).
Technically, Catalina Island would be *extremely* friendly to beginning Scuba divers with a very easy, simple (and nice!) diving spot close to their casino. They have a bunch of companies that offer “discover scuba,” so people can get a taste even if they’re not certified. But I don’t really think we have time to go to Catalina, so I’d say we dive in Santa Monica, if possible, because then we can have kind of a whole west side day that starts with morning scuba and ends with nighttime Santa Monica Pier. On our west side day, after morning scuba, we’ll make sure to take a flying trapeze class at Santa Monica Pier before the last class of the day. We’ll head up to the sprawling Getty and check out the beautiful museum. Later, after we’ve rested a little, we’ll do a class at Westside Ballet (which is a ballet studio I looove). We’ll go to the museum of Jurassic Technology (for no other special reason other than one of my favorite people loves that museum, so as a shoutout to him). This would also be a good day to go to the Sony lot tour (if they’re not TV’d out by this point), since we’re already on the west side (and I think of Culver City as like, west-enough-side). And if somehow we can get on the Fox lot (which doesn’t have official tours to the public to my knowledge, but I have visited some friends there), that’s another great west side studio option. At some point we’ll make sure to eat at the Blind Barber speakeasy which has crazy good grilled cheese. And then we’ll hang out at night at bustling Santa Monica Pier with all the rides and everything. [Note: If we missed out on anything earlier this week, or if we’re dying for another nighttime activity, like a show or concert we need to see, we could do enough at Santa Monica Pier in the daytime to probably sneak out somewhere else for the night. But if we’re not doing anything else at night, then Santa Monica Pier is a cool place to be at night.]

—Friday – Pasadena-area – Okay, if there is any way to get a tour of JPL (the Jet Propulsion Laboratory), we gotta do that. I once got a tour from someone I met on twitter, and it was incredible! JPL is SO cool and so worth touring, assuming we could make it happen. Also, we can go to the Huntington Gardens, which is sprawling and beautiful. Maybe we’ll stop by the Norton Simon museum if there’s time, as I think that’s a pretty cool museum. (I once went to a night where you got to go around and recreate the statues with this malleable, soft little pink clay stuff. I love when museums have interactive things like that.) Then for the night time activity, if Deaf West Theatre is putting on anything in LA, we must go. Seeing one of their shows feels like a transformative experience. They are “dedicated to advancing accessibility, equity, and representation for the Deaf community through groundbreaking arts projects.” And they’re not kidding when they say groundbreaking. I once saw one of their musicals where they were signing as part of the choreography to one of their songs and the music was crescendoing and crescendoing and then boom, the music dropped out completely at the biggest moment and the dancers didn’t miss a *step.* They kept dancing just as they had been – but now in *complete silence*. So, the hearing audience was transported, in a moment, into what it was like for deaf people watching the show. I think they currently have a show playing at the Mark Taper forum (but I think they’ve also played at the Kirk Douglas theatre before, hence why they’re on my mind on the west side day). So, in this hypothetical week, if a Deaf West show is playing anywhere, we gotta do it.

—Saturday – We’re absolutely devastated that our friend is leaving town. Doesn’t it feel like they just got here? I ask if there’s any way they can play hooky from wherever they’re going next so they can stay a little while longer. But we try to get as much in on this day as we can. So, I would say if there are things we missed out on from the itinerary earlier in the week because the timing didn’t work out, we can try to loop back around and pick up anything here. If not, we could squeeze a theme park in. (LA has so many great ones.) So, whatever their theme park of choice is (Knott’s, Universal (I love all the Simpsons stuff there), Disney, or Six Flags), we could head there. Or, we could probably drive down to Safari Park, feed some rhinos, and make it back before their late-night flight. Alternatively, we could go bungee jumping off the Bridge to Nowhere, which is maybe a mildly crazy thing to try to fit in on their last day, but I think we might be able to do it, especially depending what time their flight is. I know you can bungee jump anywhere, it’s not super specific to LA, but I loved jumping at the Bridge to Nowhere. Though tbh, when I did it, I did the package where you camp out, jump in the day, and then also jump at night which is like a whole part of the experience, so if they really wanna bungee jump, we may have to switch around one of these days so we can be there through the night (and/or they just gotta stay a liiiiiiiittle bit longer! After all, LA is one of the greatest cities in the whole entire world. Why would anyone want to leave?)

If they *can* stay any longer, there are other hikes, other small parks, other favorite workout classes (Sweat Garage, Ballet Bodies, Pop Physique, Bar Method, and more) I’d love to take them to (maybe not any more restaurants as we might have to do a little fasting after trying to fit all that food in!). But I think the above itinerary would be a really good overview of LA, hitting all the things I think are quintessential.

The Shoutout series is all about recognizing that our success and where we are in life is at least somewhat thanks to the efforts, support, mentorship, love and encouragement of others. So is there someone that you want to dedicate your shoutout to?
Yes, oh my gosh! So many people deserve extra credit and recognition in my story (like supportive professors when I was having open-heart surgery or bosses who took a chance on me when I was green at a job, and so many others). It’s wild how interconnected we all are; we couldn’t get places without the people who pave the roads or build the subways, plus I relied on those who drove the busses, and cooked the food, and so much more. We’re constantly benefitting from the help of others, even when we don’t realize it. But I’ll get to the question at hand and give 3 (my favorite number) specific people who had a very direct hand in enriching my life and supporting my dreams:

I’d love to shoutout my dad who has been a best friend of mine for my whole life from when he coached my elementary soccer team (we won our little playoffs ;)) in first grade to him traveling to a different city with me each year as a grown-up. He’s the best dad a girl could ask for!

Then, there’s my high school theater teacher, B, who’s still one of my best friends to this day. She’s coached me for some (successful!) auditions. She’s come to so many of my performances over the years (even if she had to fly to get there). She’s really been a mentor who’s great to explore ideas with. She even helped me pick out pictures for this magazine story! I adore her (one of my favorite people on earth!).

And my ballet instructor Jenny has such a dazzling, never-ending well of optimism – and she’s so talented and brilliant at her craft! Being her friend is a gift!

Also, I just want to say, I think it’s so cool that this question is part of your mission and values! Connecting with others is so vital to our thriving lives. The CDC says high quality relationships help reduce the risk of chronic diseases like heart disease and dementia. And Harvard’s School of Public Health says social isolation increases the risk for premature death by 29%. So, the next time you and your friend go for a walk, let them know they’re saving your life!

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